S5:E24: How Much Should You Scale?

πŸ“ˆ Scaling Your Practice Intelligently

Join Seth Price and Jay Ruane as they dissect the complex relationship between expanding a law firm and maintaining quality staff. They passionately discuss the necessity of balancing revenue with hiring, fostering a culture that aligns with personal goals, and how the freeze of winter can reshape the way we consider remote work and maternity leave policies. Get valuable insights on how to scale your firm while keeping firm values and employee satisfaction at the forefront.

πŸ‘¨β€πŸ‘©β€πŸ‘§β€πŸ‘¦ Family-Friendly Work Environments

In a candid conversation, Seth reflects on the impact of extended paternity leave trends and the profound effects these have on staffing and profitability. Jay navigates through the intricacies of cultivating a family-oriented workplace in a world where our teams often span multiple time zones and cultures.

πŸ“Š The Balance of Profit and People

As AI continues to make unprecedented strides, Seth and Jay deliberate over its impact on everyday tasks in the realm of law. They speculate on a future where AI could assist with routine legal proceedings and customer service but also openly address concerns about quality and customer satisfaction. Tune in to hear our hosts discuss how these advancements could potentially affect your firm’s pricing and service quality.

πŸ€– AI and Client Demographics

Embark on a conversation about the intersection of client experience and AI. Our hosts examine how demographics could influence the adoption of technology in firms, particularly when considering client preferences for human interactions. It’s a must-listen segment that could redefine your approach to customer service!

πŸ“š EOS Adaptation for the Agile Firm

Are you utilizing the Entrepreneurial Operating System (EOS) in your practice? Find out how smaller firms can adapt and modify EOS to meet their specific needs, creating a more efficient and goal-oriented environment.

Remember, growth isn’t just about numbers; it’s about adapting, staying receptive to change, and, most importantly, it’s about the people.



Jay Ruane 0:07

Hello, hello, welcome to another edition of The Law Firm Blueprint podcast or show or whatever we are actually, I mean, we’ve got, we’ve got this stuff going all over the place that so, you know, I wouldn’t necessarily call it a podcast but we do have a podcast, but we have a live show, we probably should just be like getting transcripts to and putting those out in the world. But anyway, how you doing today, Seth, another wonderful day here in The Law Firm Blueprint, what’s new with you?

Seth Price 0:31

You know, lots of good stuff, sort of, you know, this is the quiet before the storm end of the year, you know, from a PI perspective, there’s a lot going on, now that we’re on EOS quarterly meetings where you had to get your rocks done before the end. So lots of good sort of feel like, you know, fully in growth mode, as if, you know, a year ago, I felt like we’re getting out of COVID, now it’s can we actually, you know implement and now the, I think the limiting factor is talent, we talk a lot about that, you know, finding sufficient talent out there, I look at certain practice areas like family law, and I see insatiable demand in the marketplace, at least for a marketing law firm. And I just, you know, I think that unless somebody loves that area, and is going to train people right out of law school, I don’t know that you can fill the beast well enough to to get the lawyer, the talent needed to effectively grow the way that I’d love to grow.

Jay Ruane 1:34

Well, I mean, that begs, that opens the door to a ton of questions on on the area of growth and, and then that leads me to this question for you. Is it better to not grow in headcount of cases, and just grow in revenue and just say, you know, what, we’re not going to be able to take, you know, 100 cases this year, we’re gonna take 75, we’re gonna charge more, we’re gonna make our growth be revenue, rather than, rather than in volume of cases. And if that’s the case, do you run into sort of a limit where you’re not going to be able to charge what you want to make that type of revenue without adding bodies?

Seth Price 2:18

Yeah, and I think that that is, you know, there are exceptions to every rule, there’s a guy in every city, whether it be DUI, or whether it be family, or whether whatever, which can name price. If you’re Randy Kessler in Atlanta, he’s not charging a mild number. If you’re, you know, a legendary DUI lawyer who can get $20,000 a DUI, you know, there are people out there that do that, that those are generally the exceptions. And when you start to look at, you know, the pyramid of any law firm, outside of being that unicorn, if you want to scale and grow, it’s very hard to have an entire, you know, firm of unicorns, you’re generally going to have people at different price points. And I think that, yeah, if you do want to grow in most areas, it means as far as top line revenue, let’s say what you’re going to take home at the end of the day, a whole other conversation, right, but if you want to grow top line revenue, generally, it’s number of business units producing, you know, if you’re in, and again, this is not a value judgment, there are people that have themselves and associate themselves, they may be percentage wise, extremely profitable, and that that profit will go down, because then you need managers, and at some point, mid level managers, all the stuff we talked about, but you know, the lot I chose in life was to have a scale firm, we have over 40 lawyers. And the point is, if I want my revenue in different departments to go up, within reason, you know, I get rockstars that do better than other people, but it’s generally adding adding talent, and then making sure they have cases to, to work.

Jay Ruane 3:58

So that, that poses an interesting question, because what I think people need to think about really is what, what your end goal is, and what I have discovered, at least for me, really since COVID, and well, I think it was leading, trending this way pre COVID, COVID really sort of cemented for me is that there’s a lot of different ways to, to encapsulate what your profit is from your firm. And, for me, what I’ve discovered now is I don’t really care about the money, I care about the time and so my firm is really buying me time. So if I have to hire somebody else, and it means that I don’t, you know, I don’t see a $75,000 revenue bumped to me personally, which you know, because I have to spend 75 on them all in, but they’re giving me you know, dozens of hours a month of free time, that’s an expense, I’m willing to burden and so that, that’s why I think that people in the audience need to really think about what is it that you really truly want? You know, and, and build the firm that gives you that. Because it-

Seth Price 5:14

But that changes, doesn’t it?

Jay Ruane 5:15

Yeah I think it does.

Seth Price 5:16

Years ago, you were like, I couldn’t convince you to get out of the courtroom, you’re like, no, I get my key referrals there. I gotta be there all the time. And so some of that changes, some of it goes back and forth, based on external factors, how you feel about yourself, your relationship, family, all those things? And so to say, like, yes, you could be, you need to plot that. But I think that the more interesting thing is to figure out where you may want to be in five years, because where you want to be now may not be where you like, you know, there are people that get home, and they’re like, look, my marriage is not gonna survive, if I’m at home every day. And there, there are people that you know, that with scale, comes some flexibility, that you could work yourself out of a job. But that takes, you know, that’s not going to happen with the first couple of lawyers, because your revenue is still an important part of that percentage of the overall firm.

Jay Ruane 6:16

Right. I mean, I think it’s, I think it’s just what I’m encouraging people to do is just really think about it, because everyone talks about scale, scale, scale, get bigger, get bigger, get bigger. And that may not actually get you the end goal that you’re looking for. But it’s so easy to get- I want to 3x or 10x, my law firm. I mean, you hear it, you know, and but maybe that’s not what you want and-

Seth Price 6:41

Understood. And I’m not advocating one way or the other. But if you if your answer is that you want to be able to be less essential, where you have more time. I mean, short of becoming independently wealthy, some- somebody else has to be doing work while you’re hanging out on the T ball field. If you want to keep your revenue, you know, equal?

Jay Ruane 7:05

No, absolutely. So I don’t know. It’s just it’s something that’s been sitting with me as we head towards the end of the year, I need to make some conscious decisions on where I want to be, you know, three years from now, seven years from now, 10 years from now. So I can make some decisions. I mean, I’ll tell you right now, I’m up here in Connecticut, it is when it’s, it’s the end of November. And it’s freezing outside man. And I’m just thinking I don’t have I don’t have it in me to be cold. This much, any longer. I just It’s freaking cold outside man. And I’m thinking, we’re

Seth Price 7:39

And you’re in the thick of it. So short pulling your kids out of school and going somewhere else-

Jay Ruane 7:44

I’ve been here for a decade man. I don’t know, I don’t know. But okay, speaking of kids, this is a this is an interesting thing for someone who’s grown a firm to include remote people. And this is something that I think even if you’re you’re dipping your toe into it and adding one remote person, it’s something that you may need to think about. This happened to us yesterday, one of our longer remote workers, you know, asked for a meeting with myself, my other partner, my, basically asked for a meeting with our leadership team. And of course, the initial slack messages is, ugh, she’s leaving. This is terrible. How are we going to replace her? She has so much institutional knowledge. But I was like, I don’t think she’s leaving, she seems really happy. I bet she’s telling me she’s having a baby. And guess what, she’s having a baby. Right. But, you know, interestingly, the culture in Argentina, where she is from, you know, they take off a month and a half, two months prior to the baby being born. And then a couple of months after the baby is born. So she’s looking at being out of pocket, you know, five, five-ish months for us. And it’s, it’s an interesting thing, because, you know, if she were on our American Payroll, if she was in the state of Connecticut, you know, we have this new family leave, paid family leave in Connecticut, that would cover this and it’d be a non issue. But then the question is, you know,

Seth Price 8:45

Well not quite five months, but still.

Jay Ruane 9:00

I think they get four months here. In Connecticut, I think. I don’t know. I’d have to check. I don’t have anybody out on it right now.

Seth Price 9:25

We’ve actually, actually, our bigger issue has been paternity leave, which is nice that it’s covered. And it’s nice that people can take it. But just like this sort of out of the blue, that was our version of like, nobody’s actually taken an extended paternity leave this way before. And all of a sudden, the last several people that have had kids have all done that.

Jay Ruane 9:47

Wow, that’s crazy. I mean, we tried to give, we tried to be understanding. I know when I had kids, I would take two, the first two weeks off and then work, you know, halftime the other two weeks, and then after a month I was back I mean I was in a different position having run the firm, I kind of needed to be back at that time, you know, 13-14 years ago when.

Seth Price 10:07

Having kids, you just shut down the firm for a couple years.

Jay Ruane 10:10

Right. But but I’m sort of facing this challenge, because we have a number of remote workers who are, you know, we anticipate pregnancies, and every country, every culture has a different way they approach childcare, childbirth, and that type of thing. And so I’m wondering, what’s the way to approach this? So that we are, you know, you know, we aim to be a family friendly Law Firm, we have a lot of, you know, we have a lot of kids that are under 10. At my law firm, anything, I think, last count, there’s like, 30 kids under 10, in our small law firm, so we you know, that there’s, we’re factoring in, you know, making events and schools, being able to clock out and you know, to make the Halloween parade and stuff like that, but how do you how do you do this? When you have other cultures? Do you just say, here’s a blanket rule, we follow the American model? And this is what everyone’s gonna do? Or do you take into consideration their regional, you know, practices and accept that?

Seth Price 11:18

And I gotta tell you, we’ve been doing the show for about five years, my kid looked at it, we were like in our fifth or sixth season the other day, they couldn’t imagine. I have no idea. Like, I just don’t know. I mean, there are things that I look, I remember early on, we had somebody in the Philippines, and she came to me and said, every Christmas, we get a month pay and her bonus, I’m like, okay, I don’t know if it’s right or not. But she’s been getting that for the last 10 years. I mean, it’s such a small amount, that it’s that it seemed like, you know, fine, maybe I can’t remember it was a two week paycheck or a month, it was was significant, not significant. But I think that part of that is the fun of figuring this stuff out. I mean, even the paternity leave here, while it’s always been a thing, it is now it is become much more of a thing, people wish to take it. And again, I’m not begrudging it, I’m just saying like it is, you know, the world has changed stuff that like, I feel like I’ll give you an example of something of that just changed before our eyes with a hybrid work environment. I found that the Wednesday before Thanksgiving has gone from a half day to a no day that the the percentage of people who given the flexibility are like, well, I’m traveling, I’m gonna travel Tuesday night to miss traffic. And then Wednesday, I’ll quote unquote, work. And that, again, is stuff we’ve talked about for years, which is that being available at mother in law’s house where you don’t have an office is not really working. No, but those are the back and fourths. So I know I’m pivoting out of this. But I feel like the exciting part of what we do is seeing stuff we’ve never thought of before. I think generally it’s to take a deep breath, go back to your you know, your, your brain trust, because I gotta say, at this point, I’m detached enough that I’m probably not the right person to come up with that policy. And I rely upon my leadership team, who’s my you know, which is a pretty diverse group to sort of weed our way through these things. You know, as you mentioned, Connecticut DC has a thing, which maybe it’s up to four months, I forget the exact amount where there is maternity, paternity leave, long term disability, which has made some of the interesting economic piece of this easier. Now, and you know, now, the question is, you know, how do you staff it, which, again, at least here, there’s a little bit of leeway. But you know, it goes down to this conversation we’ve had a gazzillion times, which is the excess bandwidth concept, because this is going to, this is going to upset your applecart if you’re running really lean. And that’s, you know, those are the I feel like, you know, we talk about growth a lot on this podcast. And that, you know, there’s part of what we try to do, especially when you start is you try it, you know, we always talk about when you hire that next person, if you’re asking that question, you’re generally running pretty lean, that you’re just getting the question. And so when stuff like this comes up, that’s why I think it’s particularly challenging, because, okay, now you’re essentially into the idea of needing excess capacity, which throws off profitability issues. Something I mentioned to you pre show was, you know, back in the day, I knew most bills, most vendors, as you get further and further away, you know, there are things that are not in the top 20% But that I would love somebody to care as much about the bill as they do their own bills. So I would say if you if you take something then I realized that not everybody else, like I’m the guy who checks Uber and Lyft before I take a ride.

Jay Ruane 14:55

I know it’s annoying as heck.

Seth Price 14:59

So you know, my point is, I would like to know that before we make a purchase as a firm, that we’re at least looking at it, you know that if you’re out to lunch, somebody’s going to glance at the bill to make sure that you don’t have somebody else’s bill that you just gave the credit card for, you know, those types of things. And again, I’m bringing, I’ll bring it back to what you were talking about, which is, with with growth, there’s a certain amount of letting go. But there’s a certain amount of sort of whether it be in efficiencies, because now, if you want to have people in that country, and you’re in years where people are going to be having kids, it probably means that your rate per hour is not, you know, if you’re hiring directly $7 an hour, but really $9.50. Right, and you know, still a deal. But if you’re going through a third party service, and you’re $12 an hour, well, you’re really now $15, you know, and that meaning, you’re going to need to bring in that. And again, it’s not that $15 isn’t still a deal compared to what we have here. But it’s showing that the true economics are things that as you scale, and that again, if it was sort of, oh, she’s out, we’ll be fine. Okay, but that’s not where you’re at, you’re at a point where you’re probably running fast enough that you can let this person out for five months without other without breaking, you don’t want to break somebody else by having them have too much work.

Jay Ruane 16:23

Yeah, it’s, it’s it’s definitely a challenge. It’s something that I think, you know, as you grow as you your your business gets larger. You know, it’s just, it’s a number of factors, that things that I never thought I was gonna have to actually consider. You know, and that’s, and that’s one of the challenges, I guess, of being a law firm owner in 2023. And one that I’d like to maintain a certain level of profitability. But there’s so many factors that, you know, when I started this journey, 25 years ago, I was like, well, I’ll have a secretary, maybe I’ll have a paralegal. I’ll have a phone and a Yellow Pages ad, and I’ll and I’ll, you know, I’ll grind this out, and I’ll just show up in court. But, you know, it’s really kind of crazy. I got another topic for you that I think it’s might blow your mind. But do you know what today is the one year anniversary of? Chat GPT was released one year ago today.

Seth Price 17:19


Jay Ruane 17:20

That’s it. I mean, we’ve probably said the word AI on this show, every show we’ve had since then. And I mean, we I can remember dipping my toe into it the first time and be like, wow, this is pretty kind of crazy what it can do. And the AI tool set that is out there in a year has been astounding. I mean, this is this is not something that is like Moore’s Law where you know, every 18 months, the processor speed doubles. I think that’s what Moore’s law is. I know, it’s Moore’s law. I just don’t know what the timeframe was. But I mean, think of all the AI tools that have been created in 12 months, and what they’re doing I mean, I just I know that

Seth Price 18:08

Can I give you some perspective?

Jay Ruane 18:09


Seth Price 18:10

I don’t know, it was three, four years ago, I was like, I knew AI was coming. So we put Brenton, I spoke to a buddy who is in charge of AI at the CIA. And basically, I said what do we do, and we put Brenton on a plane to some conference in Vegas, you know, where the guy, and that was all interesting. But what, the what your point is, is in the last year, what was interesting is now accessible to you know, while, while, you know, Google was already using AI, well, before the last year, the idea that this is now accessible, and my brother in law came over for, for Thanksgiving, and presented me with a college essay for my dog Scout to go to the University of Pennsylvania because he’s very concerned with anti-semitism. It’s un-, we may be at the point by the time our kids go to college, the college essays are meaningless. That it is, again, we talked about SEO and right now we want to make sure that we’re not pissing off the Google Gods, yada, yada. But when you read, what can be created, and again, this isn’t for high level, this is the equivalent of like a high school senior writing this, it is unbelievable, to the point where, you know, those pro forma pieces I think we have you know, if you think back to the early days of the internet, where, you know, there were websites, I remember building a website was like, building a house, you’d hire a contractor, it was delayed was over budget, you know, the, think about the speed of which this is happening. It is mind blowing.

Jay Ruane 19:49

I mean, think about the other day, I actually built my own GPT on chat GPT to give me content and it was you know, give me the keywords, give me the content create an image to go with it. And, you know, you know, took me a little while to do it, I’m not the best at prompts, I’m getting better, but I just can’t imagine where we’re going to be. I mean, I see an opportunity, you know, in, in the translation space where someone’s typing in, in Cantonese, and it’s translating it to English on the fly, you know, so, you know, web chat with our, with our clients that speak other languages. It’s going to be, it’s going to be seamless, you know, and then how does that translate to real world applications and, and for us, unfortunately, for us, mainly who in are in the, in the b2c space where family, PI and criminal have to deal with institutions, like courthouses and DAs offices and insurance, defense firms and that, and the like, and other law firms, you know, what do you do when you’ve got AI tools as a family lawyer, and the other side is, you know, a seventy year old law firm that, that didn’t have, doesn’t have a CRM, which by the way, I am blown away, a friend of mine asked me about what CRM they should use. And he’s been at a firm that I looked up to as a young lawyer as the pinnacle of a well run law firm. And they have, you know, 75 lawyers and no CRM. Every lawyer just manages their own caseload, however they feel, and that blew my mind.

Seth Price 21:28

That’s the exception. To be fair, that’s not

Jay Ruane 21:33

I don’t know if it’s the exception.

Seth Price 22:01

Its the exception. The good news is, and that’s funny, because a buddy just broke off from a big firm. And I had that talk with him, I felt like was like a parent, having the talk, I’m like, its good, good, buddy. I’m like, just go buy a cleo license. It’s not that I’m advocating for cleo there are plenty of good softwares out there. But just don’t pretend like you’re doing this on a spreadsheet, because God forbid you want an assistant. Now you’re there think violations for her, and you’re in? You know, this is somebody with a couple dozen clients in a unique area of law, I guess, you know, that’s I’m seeing less and less of that. But I think that what, you know, when you think that just show you the last year, because I’m there, I don’t like as much I want to be an early adopter. I don’t like being an early adopter with technology. I mean, I would argue that the chat function, you know, through AI, is arguably better than what everything, every company that’s out there is essentially Philippine based, right chat people, and nothing taking nothing away from a wonderful group of people. But it’s just not, like the fact that the AI has now surpassed that shows you where we are on the continuum. When I say surpasses, that, has surpassed it from the point of view that I think you monetize more from that than you do from the delays, potential red herrings that are out there. Not that AI is perfect by any means, but that it is more perfect than short of having your own domestic people running it.

Jay Ruane 23:04

Yeah, I mean, you know, it’s interesting, you know, so one of the things that we’ve done since right before COVID, is we’ve been building this speeding ticket practice, something that a friend of the show, David Hanle had really encouraged me for years to do. And, you know, it’s been it’s been growing fits and starts, this was the one that people remember way back in our first or second season. My brand got delisted by Google and traffic dried up like on the second day of COVID. And I was struggling for months to try to get it restored. And it was a big, big hop in the ass. Anyway. So this has been it’s been growing, and it’s growing sort of exponentially, we 2xd to the, we 2xd the revenue from it this year, and we were talking in our leadership meeting. And we think that this is something that can be entirely done by AI. You know, this is a this is a very discreet area of law. We know what we’re getting into we have the data that we’ve accumulated, I was smart enough, or at least lucky enough to have the team that said, Well, as we do this, we know charges, we know courthouses, we know outcomes, if we have all this data, we can then use it to handicap what we charge people, what we know that the cases are going to work out for generally speaking within within a continuum. And, you know, one of the proposals that the leadership team had was, let’s take our speeding ticket, you know, and it’s a it’s a mid six high- getting to the high six figure revenue base practice area, and I think there’s unlimited potential to go up. They want to take the whole thing over to AI where AI does the call, AI triggers the credit card invoice to go out by text and to get paid and basically does the whole thing and we can take that burden off of our human people on intake. So it’s and this is isn’t something that we even considered, you know, on November 29th 2022?

Seth Price 25:05

No, agreed. And I look at anything else, right? We’ve seen a lot of things. And you have to figure out this is what’s interesting. So let’s say you did an AI product, and you charged a buck 75. What do you charge right now? Five, 600?

Jay Ruane 25:16

Yeah, anywhere between 500 is our minimum and it goes up to 1000.

Seth Price 25:22

Right so 500 to 1000. Instead, could you bring the price way down, you know, with that the next issue is how many negative reviews does Jay Ruane get, because people are not used to it, doesn’t get it, there are going to be mistakes. And if it was a complete different brands, I feel much more comfortable with it. I remember there was a guy, there was a there was a group I got interviewed on the news a few years back that somebody was going to fight tickets, you know, through and I assume it was early AI, even before Chat GPT. But what they were going to be, you were going to be able to like basically generate a letter to the court to fight your ticket in different areas, it would look for defects in the ticket. But yeah, it’s coming. And if you don’t figure it out, you know, Legal Zoom is going to do this for 100 bucks, what’s able to be done through Chat GPT, and then it hands you a handful at, you know, some number you’re not going to want to work for. So I feel like the fact that you’re thinking that way and building it, awesome. And it’s just you know, it’s interesting, because it’ll sort of conclude with this, you know, we’re watching some of the early AI answering service pieces of this come out. And I see you know, crowdsourcing the reactions, it goes two ways, some people are loving it and thinking this is the next best thing since sliced bread. And other people are like, you know, people are getting a bad experience, even if it’s one out of 10. And I’m not willing to take the bad reviews. And even if it’s not perfect having that late night answering service, I want a human being to do it, sort of interesting as you see stuff fighting through the infancy of these technologies, because there’s no doubt that if it’s okay, now, it’s going to be amazing a year from now.

Jay Ruane 27:00

Well I think it also depends on your customer base. I mean, if you’re if you are doing trust and estates, and you are getting, you know, 50 to 70 year old clientele, I think you need a live person answering the phone, if you’re if you are, if you’re you know, client base is 20 to 35 year olds, they’re much more comfortable with technology taking the lead and certain things. And so I think that’s, that’s a consideration you need to have.

Seth Price 27:24

No, absolutely. And I think that as you look at this, I think the first piece is can you get something that your firm could use, because I’m thinking about the same things. I’m, I have always had a model a lot of people sort of scoff at which is I have my criminal lawyers 20 plus sign their own cases, right, I don’t have a sales attorney, we have talked about on the show and trying to get one. But one of the things I’m thinking about as I do, as I’m doing that is okay, that person has to have all those factors put in at some point and those factors are in whether it’s a human interacting, or whether it’s aI interacting, at some point with the right data points, you should be able to within reason, quote and have, you know, and have retainers created. So it’s, you know, part of it, we used to have an automation with Infusionsoft and others. I feel like this is just next gen where you’re taking that information. And it’s taking the human element out, which I’m curious to know, you know, a buddy used to in Philly, he used to sell price based on how well his work week was doing, was a solo criminal guy.

Jay Ruane 28:33

And I know, there’s a lot of people out there that price based on what bills do I have this week?

Seth Price 28:40

Right. And I feel like the theory is here that you’d be able to do that if you take the emotion out of it. And that is that would you be better off and holding, holding it. But to be continued? I think this is this should be aired out. But I really appreciate you bringing that up. I hope this is sort of the time we’re getting ready for the holiday parties and everything else. So hope all those preparations are going well.

Jay Ruane 29:03

Yeah, you know, I’m looking forward to I’ve got my state of the firm meeting on December 14. And we’ll we’ll we’ll give everybody an update as to how we’ve done this year. So you know, Chat GPT is factoring into that conversation.

Seth Price 29:20

I’ll throw a concept out at you, which I think I got from fireproof people. Doing the state of the firm, after your quarterlies, you know, after your planning session. So the idea, I just had not thought of it this way. But at least Mike Morris does. He, he basically has his quarterlies and then his annual but each of his stand ups which are quarterly are all based after that to transmit that information. And I at least had been keeping them separate, not separate but I didn’t make that connection as much. It was always like hey, we have information to bring to the firm, rather than, I think part of that is, and I’ve seen it a Bluhark where they’re very, very good. Look at bringing the the quarterlies to each each division and bringing it all the way down to the troops. That as that happens, and as the rest of the firm starts to work on EOS, that you were, those state of the firm’s get tied, getting getting tight into your quarterlies.

Jay Ruane 30:18

Yeah no, I mean, all that stuff certainly matters. You know, and I’m, I’m curious, and this is something that I think we should talk about in the coming weeks is, if you are a firm of one or two, you know, maybe two lawyers and two staff, and EOS, you know, how do you modify EOS to work for you when it’s basically-

Seth Price 30:40

100%, well, well worth the conversation, because I feel like until there’s a management team, it’s it’s really, and I think the EOS people will tell you that it takes, the idea of putting the org chart together to see what you want, huge.

Jay Ruane 30:53

Well, here’s a perfect example, right? I’ve got, I’ve got three people on my reception team, I’ve got two people who answer the phones and one person who’s receptionist, to text messaging, you know, we have a dedicated position, they just monitor our inbound texts, because we get hundreds of them. You know, we got to figure out how to set their rocks, and can you have rocks for reception? I mean, it’s, you know, we have their KPIs of, you know, pick up after so many rings, that type of thing. But what can they do to improve its, I don’t know if there is anything.

Seth Price 31:26

Look, longer conversation, but I think that that is where it gets more interesting. And again, tale of two cities seeing it with a non law firm, which is like what’s possible. You know, we now run EOS meetings for each department within the firm within our tech department within our finance, operations, intake, but your it is, it is definitely needs to be modified. And we’ll talk about that on future shows.

Jay Ruane 31:55

I love it. All right, cool. Well, folks, happy anniversary to Chat GPT thank you for being with us here. At The Law Firm Blueprint. Of course, you can always catch us and take us on the go. By looking up The Law Firm Blueprint podcast wherever you get your podcasts. You can also check us live here in the Facebook group, every Thursday 3pm, Eastern 12pm Pacific or catch the replays as I find time to put them up and run them in the show, but we’re getting a lot of good feedback. If you have any questions for us. Please leave us a comment down below and give us a five star review every chance you get. Seth anything else?

Seth Price 32:29

That’s it.

Jay Ruane 32:30

Alright, that’s it. Have a great day, folks. Bye for now.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

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