Join Seth and Jay as they talk Fireproof/EOS, solving the problem when a great employee falls apart and more!
Hello, hello, and welcome to another edition of the law firm blueprint. I want your host Jay Ruane of the criminal mastermind as well as firm flex and Ruane attorneys and finalize and owner of some rental properties. And well, I got a million hats and oh, and the cool thing is set, you told me, you finished your chapters for Tiger tactics, too. So I’m a co author with you, which is awesome, because you’re the first other person other than me to get their chapters done. So I’m psyched to hear that. How’s your week going? This week’s going? Well, in Nice, lazy weekend. And I feel like this is the final week before for me conference season starts. We’ll be at NTL next week, we’re gonna be freaking awesome. You know, excited for that. But you know, it is balancing. You know, I felt like last year the the conference mastermind world took on a life of its own, and trying to make sure that I I control my destiny and, you know, balance the travel with the non travel. Yeah, I’m not. Well, it’s funny, I just got back this weekend I was down in, in Florida on the Gulf Coast looking at properties for a vacation home or retirement residence. I say retirement because I’m over 50 now. And I start thinking that my wife who’s not to say, it’s not a retirement place, it’s a second home. You know, she doesn’t want it, she doesn’t want to sound old, which I which I get. But you know, that’s my kind of travel, the only thing I am looking forward to, I’ve got a couple of baseball tournaments that are on the calendar, some dance competitions from eldest daughter. And that’s, that’s my travel, I don’t think I have a conference set up until April, which is, which is different for me because I used to be on that circuit, but I’m really kind of enjoying stepping back a little and it’s been nice, I don’t think you could do it. Like a conference packet. I need that oxygen. I do. And I think you know, I was writing this chapter the tiger tactics to or talked about, you know, vision. And I sometimes feel that I get trapped in my own way, when when I don’t leave the office that you know, I’m dealing with this headache and that headache. And you know, this person is, you know, pointing out they’re owed some money from a deal that was struck two years ago. And I’m like, Hey, let’s, you know, take a moment, let’s run number of real numbers, not the number they’re giving us. So like, if I paid out the difference of 10% on that deal? Would it make a difference? No, I like the idea of getting out, let some people do it through vacation, which I also love. But the idea that you’re with other smart motivated people that have done it, maybe a few steps ahead of us not the worst thing in the world? Oh, definitely not definitely not. You know, it’s, you know, that’s really the you know, you don’t want to be the smartest person in the room. You know, because if you are and everyone’s looking to you for answers, you’re not going to be able to move yourself forward. And it’s funny too, because, you know, I had my first session with Kate knock Hazel, who I know you’re gonna see Danna MTL. And she’s helping us sort of grow our firm, and we had a sort of an honest conversation about where our growth opportunities are, where we should be looking. And it’s stuff that, you know, I never even would have considered, you know, unless that question from an outsider came in and says, Hey, how come you’re not doing this? And I didn’t have some good answers to some of our questions, which caused some internal reflection of my leadership team, as well as myself. And so we’re, I don’t want to call them hard questions, because they’re not hard questions. They’re interesting questions. They’re thought provoking questions. But, you know, it’s not it’s not like the crisis. It’s no, no, no, we want to be in five years, let’s Let’s be good. It’s hard that you don’t have an answer to it. Right. And that’s an you know, those are that’s the value of those people. So not a couple plugs. One John Fisher’s mastermind experience. Honolulu, both John and Kate will be there. They he lock that in, which is very cool. But I’m going through the process right now, for dilution. We have knock Hazel doing our EOS at a Price Benowitz. And I wanted a different voice for a bunch of different reasons. At blue shark, and it’s fascinating when you see not that the EOS is EOS. But when you see people with these different skill sets in different areas, you know, it is it is fascinating to see, and we’ve sort of interviewed a half dozen coaches and the differences between them is extraordinary. Absolutely, absolutely. Well, that brings me up to a question that I want to talk about at the top of the show, because we talked about at the end of the last show, and it’s something that’s on everybody’s lips, and it’s hiring, because you know you’re in a position where you’re looking to seat some as that integrator role, you know, for lack of a better term, if you don’t do attraction ELS, that type of thing.
But it’s the person who sort of coordinates and make sure that stuff and everything on a team is moving forward.
We’re having a tremendous time a difficult time, just getting resumes in. I spoke with real talent solutions. J. Anderson, before we started our show today about the problems with recruiting. And you know, he’s helped me in the past, great connection to have really insightful, we’re actually working with him to take our two highest performing intake people and run them through sales training, he’s got a sales course that he did with one of my people, we’re adding another person into that, because we want to transition to some non attorney salespeople if possible, or at least get people to move further down the sales cycle with a non attorney salesperson. Let’s back up per se, because you can be mixing two things, each of which could be an entire series, right? We have intake and integrating sales training at the intake and you have hiring. Well, the point is I was talking to him, and he said, the problems I’m having are not unique to me. It seems to be industry wide in the legal industry, the difficulty in finding new talent come into your firm. I’ve done things as we’ve done in we’ve rewritten our job descriptions multiple times to try to appeal to different people. We’re placing them with different talking about different benefits that are available to see if certain things jump out at people who might be looking. We’re using other platforms like LinkedIn, which we hadn’t used before. Because we think some people might be surfing, looking for postings in that manner. And, you know, we’re really still struggling to get quality candidates in the door to figure operations, what are you guys do? Well, look, I would say it’s an existential threat to our firm. Ironically, on the plaintiff side, I feel more confident, and we’ve had more good people in place. But on some of the areas outside of plaintiffs work, criminal family, we are having a bear of a time finding that talent. And this is the part that love J. This is this is the problem that I have is I can’t even find the people to bring to JD interview. And God forbid you get somebody, I don’t want Jay to tell me they’re no good. Because it’s not like I have a choice. Like if I interviewed a guy today, and it probably should go to a J who is exactly what I need to lead a division. And for one of these jobs, it’s a day one I always say to people having interviewed them. I know this guy could do a job leading a practice area outside of pie if they want to. The question is, do they want what we’re selling? Do they want to build something they want to go to a place where they get a paycheck nine to five, I had somebody say that your interview the other day. So we are pushing and pulling on a bunch of areas I had mentioned to you offline, we did something unique, maybe the headline for today, which was I one of my my things that I did when I wasn’t in the office was I came up with this idea of Law Day, stupid name. But we basically invited law students and undergrads from all seven local universities. And my overall under was like seven if I got seven people in the room, I’d be happy. We had 50 people plus in the room 50 law students and like three or four undergraduate were really paralegals in the workforce. And it was unbelievable because we targeted for what we did. We found people interested in Injury and Criminal and trust in the States, etc. And that, again, law clerk opportunities because during COVID You know, I love to network take coffee’s it was the pent up demand for people to get out? A B, we brought our people in which are the best selling that we know our first and second year associates hate to use that term. We’re awesome presenting. And it was just a whole what sparked it. And I may have mentioned this on the show before. Three years ago, I got my butt out of bed and went to a GW breakfast speed, speed networking. And it was very low law student turnout. I ended up talking a bunch of lawyers. One woman were a nice woman invited her for coffee back to the firm didn’t hear from her three years later. Six months ago, she called up said, Hey, I’m in the market. I think this would be a great spot for me. She’s been six months on Dave’s white collar practice team. Originally when I met her at the speed networking she wanted medical malpractice shows you it’s a numbers game and I was just so proud of my team for taking this idea. It was a joint venture with our marketing person, our ops and our recruiter, not to mention our social media department that all came together
gather to get people in the room and then leverage it as best we could. And the energy was just infectious. So tell me a little bit more about it do what did you approach the law schools? Because somebody, may somebody in our audience may want to do this? Absolutely. It’s me. So I want that I want the playbook for it. So you reached out to law schools, what do you do you have cocktails,
everything. And you know this, you just reach out to the law schools, you get x, right? We did paid social targeting those people. We did et we use anybody that we had within our staff to get the word out through their social, we it was not a one track, but we kept pushing every angle we could, again, it was a team effort, but the recruiting department, just social and forget about free social, right? We know that’s not getting it, but paid social, how many people are targeting law students, not that many, it was cheap and easy to get in front of people. And what I loved was that it was essentially an opt in for what people want. I think time of year is important. This is a good time of year. But this was successful enough that I think there’s going to be a two to three times a year program. So did you do it and in the evening hours evening, we did it for seven in hindsight, I would have done four to six. It was we put out wine, we which was a little bit of a moment, my office manager said hey, that’s too much liability. I’m like, law students are fine rule of
fun, right? No, no, but meaning if there was an undergrad, nobody there was it turned out not a single person who’s under 21. And you’re getting birthdates on the way in anyway, on a on a form. But it was it was great. Not only do I think we have lost luck, candidate potential, potentially some people for after law school, but that’s 50 people, as you would say, in the funnel. And it was for us, the best I’ve ever had as a handful of people at the office for something like this to get in with numbers coms energy. We didn’t go this route. But I’m sure like a raffle would help. But it was almost better, because the people that came wanted to be there. And they weren’t just coming for the, you know, the air pad, air pod Max headphones that you were going to raffle off to somebody. And they were just taking a flyer they actually wanted to be at a b2c law firm. You know, it’s interesting. So that reminds me, and I want to say it was probably 10, maybe 12 years ago, now, we had an opportunity where we were giving a bunch of resumes. And this is back in the day when we would get blind resumes, you know, out the butt from all the kids in law school, or I guess that kids I mean, their kids to me, which is I’m, I’m the old dude with white hair now. Anyway. So we would get all these resumes in and I didn’t want to go through and do all these individuals. So I said, hey, we’ll go to the bar next door, we’ll rent it out, we’ll have food, we’ll have drinks. And we’ll just chat up these law students and sort of see who’s got the personality that we’d like to work with. Turns out after having that conversation, multiple members of my office all referenced the same two people, we reached out to those two people brought them in for interviews, one of them decided they wanted to go do an internship in the prosecutor’s office. So we didn’t follow up with that. The other guy, and I’ll give a shout out to him. Cold Holmes, not with me any longer moved on to was with me for as an intern, then as a couple of years as an attorney with us. And he’s a phenomenal attorney.
But he stood out to us in a cocktail party.
It was awesome. We got to know his personality. And we’re like, dude, this guy’s great. We used to do that for our intake interviews, we would do group interviews. And you know what it was for intake. It was awesome. I’m sad that we’re now more of a virtual world that the group interview dynamic
person really is, you know what I mean? That’s why, I mean, that’s why I advise people, hey, get to the third or fourth interview before you extend a job offer because anybody can key themselves up for the first interview. You know, they’ve practiced their answers. But you started the personality starts to come out at interview three, haven’t talked about this. But one thing that I prided myself on pre COVID, and I can’t tell you, it’s being done at the same level is the shadow day, my shadow day became a half day became an hour with Zoom. It’s who knows what it is. But the idea is, you’re not doing it for and it became a bit of a hustle, right as a paid as an unpaid like, pay it. I don’t care, right? God forbid somebody doesn’t make it. It’s the money. You know, this process is not cheap. So if you could get if you like somebody and then you find out you don’t after a shadow day, God bless. Right? Yeah. When that happened, we’ve had the shadow turnout and say, Wow, this is not a good fit, but you want to put on paper in an interview. No, I look and I think that part of it is you got to show up, right? So what avoids the first day not showing up? I’m gonna I’m gonna bring you bring you something somebody said to me yesterday, one of our clients and it got passed along to me. What’s the best ability to have in the NFL availability? I mean, that’s really what people have to show up. They gotta be ready. I
Think the giants are living proof of that they have to chip, you know, go into the next beat another wildcard round. Practice squad. I mean, it’s amazing. Exactly, you know, you got to put yourself in BMV. There, that’s one of the issues that we’re dealing with is we have a lawyer who’s continually out on leave, and, you know, just unable to accomplish their job. And we’re trying to find a way to make it work. But look at the same difference I have an administrative person who has been a favor to the firm was thinking about leaving the year before got a substantial raise, and has had a terrible year, a lot of unused, unscheduled time out at the last minute stuff that’s inexcusable not returning after a half day a jury duty, things like that. And,
you know, we’re sitting in a position where we love this person, but you’re not going to, you know, they got a bad review. And we are in a position where we, you know, you know, where we don’t want to give a raise, and the person is very upset. And I’m like, I think to a certain extent, that’s one of those moments where you’re like, we love you, we want to give you a raise the fact you’re not getting a raise, it’s all you. So again, and that’s sort of the I don’t know if you can see what it’s not us, it’s you. Well, truly, and I think that what I have seen, this is something that’s happened over time has been that if you have an expectation you hold to it in any job, the people that shouldn’t be there break and leave. And that in theory, should reduce the agita of having to fire people that just holding to Hey, you do what you want, but it’s not going to be a raise, we’re not happy. And you know, eventually that person’s like, oh, I don’t want to be in a place where I’m not appreciate. Well, cha, well, if you did your job, you’d be appreciated, we’d love the person. And so it’s a very, you know, I’m sure this lawyer, if they showed up would be your favorite person, they just need to show up when he when he shows up, he knocks it out of the park. You know, we were doing this right now, even on our reception team, we have a new new hire, who’s still on their probationary period or three weeks in four weeks in, and we’re looking at the metrics and they are answering, you know, 40% of what other people are handling. And and we don’t know why we’re like, why are you so early that can be training that could be tweaks, you know, that’s what that but, but But this, it leads me into my next point that I want to discuss is that you need to have actual metrics and KPIs for these people to be held to. Because a lot of people in our shoes and I’m guilty of this.
I for years, I was guilty of this, I bring people in and be like, Okay, here’s the job, good luck.
Let’s take a timeout for a second. Because a lot of people listening to this show are in growth mode, they may only have one of those people. And I you know, you are king of systems, no argument. But you even you sort of through this sort of story or parable is it is not possible always to have metrics for thing, you don’t know what the right number is you can measure it, which is good. But if 40% is off, the only reason you have an inkling is because you have scale to know what to compare it to.
Well, yeah, because I have multiple people in that. Know what historically, in high a high average person can handle what you like, question is, do you know what your good people did, because you’d have data then on their second, third, fourth week, meaning apples to apples, but they have two people in the role right now that are in that training period. One of them is hitting the benchmarks that we have set consistently without a problem. One of them is at 40%. And so they’re both being trained simultaneously, which leads me to think hey, if if they’re being trained the same way at the same time one’s hitting the standards which we’ve set for the department and the other one is as below half that we know which one we’re losing at the end. Let me take you back to your we hired to at the same time I’m gonna take you back to the single days and I think this this treasure boys and girls the same way back in the day, right I’m in New York and the 96 in the cities like parallel in my life. And there was
are you Mr. Big I literally I lived in the apartment building only Rachel in Central Park West at the time was were Samantha lived before she buzzed in the wrong guy. And he mugged somebody in the building as she moved to the meatpacking district. That was my building. I was offered the walk on role of the elevator operators a manual elevator in the building. I couldn’t do excited busy day. And when I came home, Samantha stayed in character and flirted with me, which was possibly the best 10 minutes of my life.
But putting that aside for a second, I digress. Is that there was a saying and I’m sure you remember, you never know. Right? You went on a date and the person was she was, you know, a member you know, she was, you know, an adjunct member of the class.
And then she, you know, had really bad breath. You never know. You know? And it sucks. But you do know. And with this situation, that’s one of those places where you’re going to play it out because you never know. But is this person going to be your rockstar employee? Most likely? And so what I would say is, with this, it pivots to sort of a point that I was going to bring up, which is part of your job, though, when you’re interviewing or with an employee is saying, okay, look, this person isn’t fast enough to do the intake I need, is there a home for them? Right? If you’ve got them already familiar with your systems, your CRM, like them who involved you like them, you’re trying to find a role to make them fit. I think it’s a double edged sword. We have been particularly bad at transferring people from role to another role. At best, it’s mediocre at worst, it’s awful. We’ve had a lot of negative experiences. That said, I still keep trying still keep tilting at windmills. But I’ll give you an it’s something that I’m looking at right now. So he’s dangerous, because we’re in real time. But there’s somebody with one role at the firm, who’s very good. Right? And our head office administrator lost her deputy. We’re big enough now that I have a head of ops and a deputy head of ops and the deputy head of Ops had personal issues and and moved on.
And we see somebody that could be really good for that role. Here. It’s the opposite, right? Normally, it’s the person’s not working, there’s a defect, and you’re gonna try to move them somewhere else. Hey, it’s not right. Today. Jay, maybe it’s right today, David, you know what I mean? Like, maybe, but like, there’s probably a reason not that, like, some people would be right for somebody else. That’s a much harder jump to man, this person’s amazing. I know they’re doing well, but they’re sort of in a dead end job that doesn’t have an area for advancement. What if I could put them in a place where there’d be increased salary, and I could keep somebody over time, we have a lot of people that law school is a possibility. And I keep one of the things I’ve come up with. And in fact, our head of intake came to me with this, I was just reminded, who said, I really think I want to go to law school at some point, which we’re hoping doesn’t because they’re now making great money and hopefully have a career path. But I want to be a paralegal. So I’m leaving because I want to be a paralegal. And they went for a few weeks, and they came running back. And I hope that this was part of it, which is being a paralegal is not getting you into law school. And it’s not getting you a job after law school. If you if you had somebody come to you and said I just did law school, and I ran price benefits intake for two years. That’s an easy hire for most people. Right? So the thought being that, you know, in this type of situation, pivoting, when it’s not a problem, where you’re giving something up, she’s solving a lot of problems for some person saying, Hey, we see there’s a better and greater value to that person, there’s still an office of that old job needs to be done. But actually looking for that advancement, the double edged sword is not only to convince the person she’s working for currently, Hey, she’s not going to be a person for you. But this person, I’m thinking about going to law school and all of a sudden, I’m going to stop doing legal work in quotes, non lawyer legal work, which to me is a fiction, meaning, it’s, it’s a real thing. But you get your law degree, you’re practicing law with few exceptions. There’s some non lawyers in law firms that do real substantive work. But many times the person who doesn’t have a law degree is doing something that is they will do dramatically different when they get out, hey, let’s give you an opportunity. It’s something that gives you three things, right? One, you may say this is a career track that I can make a great living and be happy with. Second, I go to law school, and it’s not going to prevent you to get in, you still have the other piece on your resume. And third, let’s say going to law school. Now you have an extra skill set for when you get back. Not only can you be a paralegal, but you’ve actually helped run a significant size firm. And each of those things I would think make you more marketable in the long term. But Oh, absolutely. So again, just basically the thought of push promoting and pivoting up even when it’s not broken, because those are the two examples, right? Broken person you’re trying to save versus Rockstar, you want to get more value out of it. Yeah, yeah. I mean, and that’s actually the pivoting thing is something that I’m trying to do with this attorney that I would like in 2023, part of my mission for the firm. i We i had my State of the Union a couple of weeks ago. I think I talked about it earlier show. Part of my mission is, you know, NPs KPIs and customer service, I want to really sort of distinguish us.
In the terms of customer service, I want to have an outbound attorney whose job it is to make phone calls and if I can just get this attorney healthy. And back in the office. I think he’s perfect for the job. Well, I guess the this is the piece that’s very hard, which is if it can be done collaboratively.
Let me ask you a question. Play Play dot doc here for a second.
This person, right and I get it, I’m feeling the situation person not showing up incredibly frustrating when this person is not here who’s making those outbound calls? Nobody.
So it’s a whole new role, because because I want to keep them employed even part time, if I can, the job that that we can foresee for this role for this attorney is a probably a 25 an hour a week job, which they crush, kick asset.
You know, it’s handling administrative hearings, on our DUI cases, we do have, you know, enough of a volume of those, that it could be a understood, do they show up for those or they call out sick for those, they show up for all of them? So I mean, again, he’s calling in and getting continuances from his hospital bed. You know, he’s,
this is this isn’t just drama in their life? No, no, this is legit medical infirmity.
Right. But obviously, you know, that their issues once somebody claims a medical disability, or, you know, I absolutely put that in one box. But look, very often, I have found that if you fight through somebody on that at the other end, again, somebody’s so sick, that they have to resign, it’s happened. But if they do make it through, you have one heck of a loyal employee. And that’s and you know, I know, I know, this employee has skills, and I don’t, and from the conversations I’ve had, you know, he’s like, working here is my dream job. This is doing what I want to do with the people that I, so it sounds like, I’m like, why am I going to kill crush this guy’s spirit, if it’s just a medical thing that we can come back from, I just don’t know, if we’re there yet, I got to talk to the employment lawyers, we got to find a path forward, that can work because I don’t have people that can pick up the slack. So I need to replace them. You know, it, you know, to do the work, otherwise, it’s going to be me. And I don’t have an extra 25 hours in my week, to be able to do this stuff without other things suffering.
So that’s really where I am with that. And we’re gonna see what happens over the next, you know, month or so, I’m going to conclude today, I have a thought that it probably resonates for both of us. But I just had a wake up call, which was like, I build out offices, like many people using Google business profiles and think about what I want. There was an area I wanted to expand into. And I recognized I have web content for it. But I had not built out the offices and knowing that the offices take time to incubate, meaning it’s like almost like a sandbox effective for the SEO side, that I feel that as I reflected, I had this great interview today, I’m like, this would be great. I realized that I have not been aggressive enough, in anticipatory really gaining local real estate, when there’s an area I want to move to. And I know that I say this, because I think you’re going through this process right now, we’re not where you want to be when you grew up, but are there parts of the state you wish to cover? excetera. And that the, you know, just like in the old days, we used to buy domains, thinking about crazy cockamamie businesses we wanted, I almost feel that the importance of local, we’ve had shows about how important maybe more important than a website, the idea of trying to gain traction, locally, even before the hire comes knowing that if it’s not in place, it’s easy to say, but a lot of ways to get reviews, you got to get it to stick you need the off. But assuming you could get that that the that the curve for organic build out in an area, that doing it on spec, it’s which comes first right, the hire somebody that build it out easy, but then you have an issue where you’re sucking wind, the person may not be incentivized enough. Whereas if you’re rolling in cases, and it’s a third generation, you’re going to be in a much better position to keep that cash flow. Yeah, no, I mean, what we’ve what we have done is we’ve taken the approach of build the office and and, and float the office and the attendant costs that go with it before we hire somebody to to run that area. I mean, what and the way we’ve done it is we’ve actually layered over, we’ve taken a map of the of the geographic area that we serve, we layered over it a screen of population density, a layer, a layer of arrests, convicted arrests, things and so we’re looking for holes, and then we also did have competition, right so we’ve got like, you know, it’s like you know, back in school, you know, the map of the teacher with the transparency on that another one and another one you start to see we’re doing the same thing. And just just point of clarification friend of the show, longtime listener Adam Rossen. This does not mean you go out and buy a $3,500 office and fully staffed before there’s business. This is an incremental piece where you spend the least possible to get the foot in the door just want to make sure because there’s people’s Oh, example I found an office that was
See, for $375 a month in an area I want to get into. I just signed up, I’m sponsoring some kids soccer teams and, and some little league teams in that community, you know, so I’m starting to reach out and do things and they’re pointing to the page, you know, that type of thing before, I’m going to be able to put an attorney in that office. Or if I’m ever gonna have an attorney, maybe it’s just a meeting space, I don’t know, we’re gonna see one thing I want to say before, we said, I’m a little bit of a tech nerd. And I’ve got something that I got today in the mail, and I want to show it to everybody, because it’s really cool. I just started playing around with it. It’s the Elgato stream deck. And it’s super cool. It’s actually
its actual physical buttons that can launch apps, or web pages, or whatever. So if I want to launch iMovie, on my computer, I can just press the iMovie button that I’ve created, or my email for my criminal mastermind or ruin attorneys, my daily calendar with some perfect if I want to get to Canva, I can just press this button. And the my computer knows to launch it right to the webpage that I want. And so my idea
was leaving my windows open for days on end, it’s, well,
no, but no, you can do that. But what this is cool about this is that I just started playing around with it, you can do multi step things. So like for me for next week, when we go to go live, I’m going to have a button at that point. That is the law firm blueprint, which will bring up zoom, have the zoom Connect to Facebook, start my lights, bring down my lights, start my microphone, do all of these steps with
automation. Got it.
I’m loving this. It’s not the webpage. It’s what’s on the webpage. Right now I’m doing web pages because I literally open the box a couple hours ago. But there’s so many cool things that you can do with this. And it’s I’m really excited about it. So to be able to do things with a but button press to get yourself set up. Or for me to be able to do some editing in iMovie. I think this is going to be such a cool thing. So it’s something that people out there should be looking at, as a way to automate things in your office. I can even press a button here and send a text message to my wife saying, I’m leaving the office, I’m on my way home, stuff like that. It’s just cool to do. So.
That’s a great show. I really enjoyed this
is a good show. So that’s gonna do it for us, folks. As always, you can catch us every week here live 3pm Eastern 12pm. Pacific, on Facebook. In the law firm blueprint. Of course, if you’re hearing us on our podcast, which is available, everywhere podcasts are available, be sure to give us five stars, and subscribe to our show so that you can catch up every time we release a new episode. And as always, if you want to catch up with Seth, he’s at blue shark digital. You can catch them on his social platforms, as well as me. You can find me anywhere you want to go. That’s gonna do it for us, Seth,
any friends of the show? ping me on Facebook. Text Message. I’ll be down there. Let’s grab a drink in Miami.
Oh yeah. In my ear going to Miami. So enjoy that. That’ll be fantastic. It’ll be it’ll be a great time. I know. I was down there a couple of years ago. It was nice to get away from the cold of the Northeast. So folks in NCL have a wonderful time there. We’ll catch up with you next week. Bye for now. Transcribed by https://otter.ai