Intro 0:00
Welcome to the SEO Insider with your host, Seth Price, founder of BluShark, taking you inside the world of legal marketing and all things digital. Welcome everybody.
Seth Price 0:11
We’re so excited to be here with Angel Reyes on the SEO Insider. Welcome to the show. Oh, thanks for having me. So look, you came on my radar a ways back as a guy who was doing similar things in Texas to what we were doing on the East Coast. So tell me a little about your story. How did you come to be, to be this juggernaut in Texas?
Angel Reyes 0:31
Well, it was a 33-year overnight success, as the joke goes, no, but the firm’s been around for 33 years. And, you know, we started out doing auto and truck cases, you know, representing, you know, injured victims, of course. And you know, when we, when we first started, back in like 93 I want to say we, you know, I speak Spanish, and so a lot of our clients were Spanish speaking, and there wasn’t a lot of, weren’t a lot of lawyers that were meeting that market. And I didn’t really know that. And I didn’t really know that for the next three decades, there would be an enormous amount of immigration from Spanish-speaking countries that were, you know, going to be in Houston and in Dallas and Austin and so, you know, the firm grew that way first. In fact, I would say, until about 1999 seven out of 10 clients were Spanish speakers. Wow. And then, and then, slowly but surely as many of those families, all of a sudden they have kids, and those kids have gone through school here, you know now, it’s kind of the opposite. We have about 70% English speakers, 30% Spanish speakers, but it’s, that’s how we made our bones. And it was a really interesting story. I mean, I was working at a firm that is, that is now Foley and larger here in Dallas. It wasn’t then, but it is now. And one night, a cleaning lady came by and asked if I could help her son because she saw my name on the door, you know, so I’m in the holidays. So I was like, Yeah, you know, I speak Spanish. You’re like, hey, come, come help me with my son. He’s at Baylor Hospital, a big hospital here in Dallas, and he’s in bad shape. I see you. And I mean when I say bad shape, I’m in bad shape. And so I, I naively go back to the law firm I’m working at and say, Hey, I’d like to help this, this person who’s been in the fat car, right? And a couple of the partners looked at me like I had a third eye. And they’re like, you know that, like AIG and Chubb are some of our biggest clients, right? I’m like, so you know, I didn’t, I didn’t know, I didn’t know enough to know back then, right? And I said, Man, I’d really like to do this. And I talked to a good friend of mine who was also at that firm, and I said, Man, I think this is going to be a case that settles for a lot of money. And he’s like, Well, see if you can find out. So I made him send me the deck sheet, and I was 300 grand, right? And I figured they owed every bit of it. And so I said to my friend, “Why don’t we, why don’t we quit? And so we resigned, and then, like, four weeks later, we settled the case and took our fee and ran around and tried to find a bank that could open a trust account. And so, you know, that’s kind of how we got our start. It was like 30, almost 33, years ago. And so that was interesting. And then, of course, we just kept meeting the market. I started doing a lot of TV advertising, Univision, you know, that was kind of, nobody did it back then. I was a pioneer in that regard. You know, I think I was spending like 25 grand a month, but the phone was ringing off the hook. We had 150 clients in 45 days. I mean, it was that crazy. And so, you know, that’s, that’s how we got started. And you know, we’ve never really looked back. We have been, you know, admittedly distracted. You know, in the late 90s, we got distracted by dive pill litigation, fan, fan, and then we got to tell you if
Seth Price 4:01
you’re gonna take, if you’re gonna take a little teacher, not a bad one, to do, yeah,
Angel Reyes 4:05
you know, but, but it ended up really not working out that great for us. You know? We ended up we
Seth Price 4:11
with respect, like, if you’re gonna take a flyer, that was not a bad one, take a fly.
Angel Reyes 4:15
I certainly thought that, and I was, and I was young enough to forget some of the lessons that I have that I now, didn’t know some of the lessons I know now. And so, you know, we also got distracted a few times from 2003 to about 2015 by some other mass torts, you know? Yeah. So we’ll get to that in
Seth Price 4:35
a moment, because I want to hear, hear your thoughts on that, but talk about the firm structure itself. How have you built it out? What do you price?
Angel Reyes 4:42
So that, you know, our firm is relatively big now, but you know, it really started it. It went from like 70 to 90 people to triple, quadruple that, starting at around 2019, and that was, believe it or not, the year I said, I would never. Or do another mass tour. It was, it was the year that I said I was only going to do auto and truck. We already had about 300 verdicts by then. You know, now 400 by 350 ish verdicts in mostly auto and truck cases couple slip and falls and, you know, a couple like explosive type, you know, workplace stuff where you could actually sue. And I was like, you know, that’s what we’re good at. Let’s just, let’s just buckle down focus and just only do that. And so once we started focusing in 2019, until now, we really got the flywheel going. You know, we’ve read books like, Good to Great, you know, there. And we did EOS traction. And that was us in 2019 you know, I thought I was late because, you know, I actually got to meet Gino Wigman up in Chicago at a conference. And, you know, everybody up there like that was, man, if you haven’t been doing this for a decade. You’re way behind. I was like, Ah, I better hurry.
Seth Price 6:03
up in legal space. You were probably other than maybe Mike Morris. Nobody else was on it at that.
Angel Reyes 6:06
point. Well, you know, Mike, Mike’s got his fireproof, and it’s, it’s similar, you know, he was his coach, yeah. I mean, I read, you know, I read Fireproof recently, and I’m like, oh, rhymes a lot with the Eos. And we’re really glad we did it. And by, you know, by doing that, you know, what does that do for a company? Rigor, measurement, management, meeting, Cadence, you know, finding you gotta put your rocks up for your quarters. You gotta put your goals up for the month, for the quarter, for the year. We have a once, one-page strategic plan that includes all seven of our departments, and every department has a leader, and then those leaders have other managers, and those managers have most of the people downline. So it’s structured like a regular company. You know, no different than you would find anywhere else. We happen to have fewer lawyers than most firms this size. What’s your split lawyer versus ours Yeah, our ratio is, it’s, it’s close to 20 to one. So we have 20 nonlawyers for every lawyer. The lawyers really kind of stick to, you know, lawyer work, you know, filing, reviewing a petition filing. It is reviewing, reviewing the discovery, after paralegals have kind of finalized it for the most part, doing mediations, doing depositions, you know, attending hearings and trying a case if it gets that far. And so, you know, the rest of the folks do most of the other work. And so, you know, that’s just, it’s just our way of doing it, not saying it’s right. It’s definitely a little different than some other firms. But, you know, we got to sort of create this. We’d had a firm for a long time that did things a lot like everybody else, until about 2019, and for six years now, we really tried to change the way we do it. We called it. Let’s burn the firm. Let’s burn the house down and rebuild it, which is essentially what we’ve done. And you know, it was, we luckily had a good foundation, though, you know, we had, you know, damn near 25 years, 26 years of a foundation. So while we burned the house down, we did not burn the foundation down. We still had a foundation. We still had 1000s of auto and truck cases, and so, you know, we just started filing more lawsuits and expecting better results. That’s
Seth Price 8:27
awesome. Quick question, which is first, because I get and appreciate what you did burn down the house probably more than you can imagine. First use international and domestic staff, or is it what we do, in
Angel Reyes 8:40
In Texas, we have about 125 employees. They’re mostly in Dallas, I’d say 100-ish or in Dallas. And then we got about 10 in Fort Worth, which is, it’s called Dallas Fort Worth, but it is 42 miles away. And, you know, it’s far enough away that it can support another office. And we have an office in Houston, have a handful of people in Austin, and have a handful of people there. But all the lawyers are up here. We’re kind of a, you got to work in the office if you’re a lawyer. And that’s kind of, that’s kind of one of our we’re that company. You have to work in the staff as well, or staff can have so-so staff in Texas work in the office, but we do have a lot of offshore employees. In fact, I think we have, like, over 400 over 400 offshore employees that do a lot of sort of what, I think most people just say back office work. You know, that goes everything from, you know, gathering records in Texas, you have to get affidavits, which is a, you know, kind of another tough step. You can’t just submit copies of the medical bills. That’s not good enough, especially if you’re going to file a lawsuit. We file, and most of our cases get filed, right? So we have to have them in affidavit form. That means that affidavit. For the bill, affidavit, for the record, for every single one, for every single case. And that’s a big lift. I think we got 7080 people doing that, you know, because if that’s what it takes for us to stay on pace and to get those records in a timely fashion, we have about three-quarters of our, what I call, sales floor. You know, the folks who are doing new client calls are in a number of other countries, mostly Central America, because of their Spanish speaking abilities with
Seth Price 10:29
virtual or do you have them in? Do you have a location there? Now, we
Angel Reyes 10:33
don’t have a location there, but there are direct employees.
Seth Price 10:36
No, I get but meaning it’s, you have a contract. I mean, they are sitting in their own homes, working for them, virtual desktops, etc,
Angel Reyes 10:45
right? Most, most of them. There is one spot in Managua, Nicaragua, where I think about 20 people prefer to go, and so we have a teeny little officer. But
Seth Price 10:56
did you build that out yourself to use contractors down there to help you put together BPOS or No,
Angel Reyes 11:02
no, we kind of did it, or we did it. We did it because my cook had worked a couple of 20 years ago, a couple of decades ago, at a company that wanted his help to go international. I think he opened close to 30 offices around the world. And that experience led him to believe that, look, you can get on a lot of these, these sort of job finding sites for any for the whole international community, looking at them. And you know, he started that way by getting some resumes, and then we started interviewing people. We started talking to him, and then we went down there. So we went down to Nicaragua, and this is our first, like, 6080 people. And we got, we got really lucky when we got there, one of the people that had interviewed with us had recently been let go of by an insurance company called Gaines CO and as an inch, I don’t, I don’t, they’re probably nationwide, but it’s a smallish insurance company, but they were setting up a bodily injury and property damage claims in Managua, and he brought 150 people that used to work there, and we decided to hire like 60 of them, like on the spot and they were all working from home already. And so, you know you, you got to do some things with offshore folks. You know you, we have an active track, which gives us some indication that they’re there. And we also use Zoom rooms. So for every 10 employees, they’re in a team and they’ve got a lead, a team lead, we call them. And the team lead has all, all 10 of them on camera. Or, you know, you just don’t get paid that day. And so, you know, we don’t, we don’t try to be a super big brother, but we really do try to encourage people to look at the Zoom Room a as a resource, like, Hey, if you, you know, if you got a question, ask some of the people here, some of them been here longer than you, your lead is right here on top. Ask, ask him or her a question. And we found that to be pretty effective. But, you know, can I, can I say, Oh yeah, everybody’s putting in eight hours for us, I don’t know, but I think most people are pretty, pretty. They’re giving it a go. They’re trying. I tried
Seth Price 13:27
the Zoom Room, way, way back, and got down even before. We’ve only been international since January 21 Okay, built out a huge international presence. But you said something that struck a chord with me. So, you know, running both price benefits, which is 250 lawyers, and BluShark, which now has, like, you know, over 100 employees, and like three clients, you know, national, now, International. You know, one of the things that always strikes me is we run EOS in both we run fireproof at the law firm, which is, you know, a version of Eos. And we run pure Eos, the marketing company. And, yeah, you know, you go to, and this is true for most friends that have law firms versus marketing companies, other than you who burned down the house and rebuilt it. If you go to the average law firm that’s running Eos, and you ask, What are you, what’s your percentage of rocks completed? If they’re being honest, the over, under the spot on 40% right? Whereas, you know, at BluShark, you know a young sort of, you know, data-driven business, you have over 80% rocks completed, right? And I always wonder, why can’t I have that? And I’ve always wanted to do what you did, which is eliminate all the legacy nonsense. And, you know, obviously, you want to keep the fundamentals of the great large, but you want, you want to be able to run it more like a business. And I feel like, especially, you’ve done this for three decades, the number of layers of nonsense, you know, like. Almost like, you know, if you look at the analogy of James Mitch and the source, where there are layers of things that take place, and you dig down, you see all the bodies that are buried down in the archeological dig that you’ve basically said, You know what, we’re going to keep our foundation here, but we’re going to purposely build up, rather than just keep adapting to what we have,
Angel Reyes 15:21
yeah, I mean, look, it was, it wasn’t an easy, easy decision, that’s for sure. And not everybody survived it, you know. I mean, a lot of people left. And, you know, maybe it was probably for good reason. You know, once, once, once, we kind of once, we decided that there was going to be a lot of rigor and a lot of meeting cadence and that we were really going to follow it, you know, slowly but surely, people tapped out. You know, they opted out, but the ones that stayed are killing it now. They’re, they’re in management roles. You know, when you’re a growing firm, people have opportunities. You don’t, you don’t get stuck in the same job for 10 years. If you want to, if you want to move up, just raise your hand and we’ll talk to you about it. And, if we have an out and an opportunity for you. We’ll give it to you. And so we think that’s really helped the dynamism of the workforce here. Well,
Seth Price 16:08
you also something that did, sort of like, this is a this is a beast, right? You know, with the number of hundreds and hundreds of people there, and I something, Jay and I talked about our sister podcast, the law firm blueprint, which is, okay, you know, it’s one thing to sort of start a firm. It’s another. Have like, you know, get to a point where you have, you know, managers, and you have people under them. But the scary part is when you have mid-level managers you’re no longer touching the manager that touches a person, and now you have multiple layers of mid-level management, if that’s true, right? Because, if you take the attitude. I’ve come to the conclusion that anything over eight direct reports is kidding yourself. You go to 10, but like, yeah, we’re kind of a 10, but, yeah, right. But that means employees nine and 10 don’t really get that much love. It’s like the third child or fourth child. Like, so much you got the first two that we got a third you know. And so, you know, when I look at that and I think about the permutations, the good news is, you automatically get the opportunity, because you need people. It’s, you know, it’s not like, you can just say, Here, here’s 100 people. You’re like, no, here’s a pot of 10, who’s managing them, and who’s then, you know, training that manager, right? Who’s managing the manager? And like, all of a sudden, you know, and that’s why, when you look at the expensive stuff, you’re like, you know, very often firms like ours look at like, low dollar pi. And there’s a reason you want it because the person who has the smallest possible case could come back with the giant case. But every employee you add brings risk and further permutations mean you have a 500th worst employee, right? That toggles the money somebody, somebody’s right there, right? You have a 100th worst pre-lit paralegal like, and with each of those you’re, you know, and Chad Dudley, one of my favorite guys in the space, you always say, you know, at some point in that organization, something’s being screwed up on any given day, and you Angel, have to be like, Yeah, and I’m okay with that. Not that you don’t want that, that you want to fit, but like, you wouldn’t be more than like a two-lawyer shop if you were able to sort of conceptualize, put the systems in place. You know, small shops have issues too. It’s not like their person, you know, one person has an issue. So I, to me, what’s really fascinating is, what lessons have you learned as you sort of created this, because it’s not like you have, like, hundreds of hundreds of people without thought, the orchestra must be a work of, like, a cost solid,
Angel Reyes 18:47
yeah, it’s a, it’s a to put it on a board and be a pretty good sized board. We will look at one of the things that you know, that we also do is, you know, like, like you said, like, who’s managing the managers. We have group managers, alright. And the group managers will have five folks in their in, you know, if it’s pre-lit or litigation, paralegals or, or even the lawyers have a group attorney manager, and there are five, five or six lawyers for one attorney group manager, and their job is just kind of help lawyers, you know, get unstuck. Sometimes they meet their goals. Help them meet their goals. You know, tell them. Tell them when they’re not, tell them when they are. And that goes across the entire or so. You know, our firm is structured that way, so that, you know, the people training are not the people managing, and the people managing have managers above them. And because we’ve really taken that whole KPI part of the OS, like, super seriously. I mean, it’s still, to this day, we’re still refining it. I mean, you know, we, we happen to use a database, solidify that’s built on Salesforce, and it. Very robust. I mean, you can do an awful lot of reporting and dashboards and other tools to help the folks that you’ve got helping you manage the people that are underneath them, that that you may not ever touch, you know you may not even hear about. But if you, if you, if you put in enough of those measurable activities, we know that that activity is really what we’re looking for to move cases and get things done. And so when those triggers get hit, that, you know, we generally know things are rocking along. And so, you know, look, you can’t be a control freak. If you’re a control freak, you’re in trouble. You’ve got to believe that the people that you’ve empowered are going to do the best they can.
Seth Price 20:46
So pivot for a moment. You know, we met during the marketing track at a number of these conferences. And, you know, I personally, again, it seemed late to the game compared to you on a lot of this stuff. You know, we got to EOS later, we were digital only for years, grew to almost 50 digitally, and then over time, added in Spanish TV, added in radio, talk to me a little bit about your journey and how you had what the path was, as far as building out media. And you know, to me, I came to the realization that it was the combination of some of these media that really ended up paying dividends. Whereas I, you know, for years, love the ROI of digital, and sort of got intoxicated by, I want to get here about your journey.
Angel Reyes 21:35
Well, you know, early on, until, until at least 2016 It was mostly broadcast media. We, you know, I think we were spending, I don’t know, 20 million a year on broadcast media. We were in, we were in a couple of markets, in Austin and in Dallas, mostly Spanish media, or everything, no, no, everything, English, Spanish, you name it. By then there were so many bilingual people. And you know, if you’re bilingual, you generally are going to be watching English TV. You know, the Spanish TV is really, you know, for people that just can’t, you know, can’t watch something in English. It’s a, it’s a, it’s an acquired taste. In my personal opinion, Spanish TV, it’s a kind of soap opera. But, yeah, there’s other cool stuff. You know, it’s not like that’s all there is. But, you know, we started that way. We started with it was, it was 90% 90% broadcast media. Then in 2016 or actually, about 2014 we started laying off some of the budget on Google, and we started, I think maybe what you saw, what maybe you saw, and that was ROI on digital, was smoking, smoking, broadcast TV. And so by 2016 I started really moving big pieces of budget. We were. By 2016 we were, we were 7525 digital, 75 digital, and then in 2021, I ran my last television campaign, and we’ve been only digital since then. But our digital prop, you know, our digital channels include, you know, obviously paid LSA, you know, SEO, we don’t forget that that’s, that’s part of that foundation, if you will. And, you know, we experiment with YouTube, and all the other social media properties, some are better than others, at least. You know, we haven’t completely cracked the code on each of them, but, you know, we’re still doing each of them, but the majority of the money is in Google and LSA, you know, that’s where we spend the majority of our of our paid search money. But you know what we also, you know, we get cases from other lawyers. We get cases from clinics. We get about 100 cases a month from former, former clients or friends. You know, people that kind of just know us and they don’t. All they do is Google this and call us and what you haven’t. They already knew about us. They had an introduction. I
Seth Price 24:04
I think that’s the intersection where I’ve sort of, I have not grown up, but where I see that the advantage of the digital goes beyond just people that have never heard of that was always my look. Built the agency and build a firm, but that when you have those other tentacles, even if it’s experimenting on social, even if it’s, you know, billboards, even if it’s happy clients, we think a lot of ourselves, but when somebody leaves us two years later, they may not remember the name of their lawyer, and then when they go to do a search like, oh Yes, that’s it. And I feel like that’s almost as I look at the value of radio or TV today, very few people are listening to a call to action. Oh, I’m going to call right now. Versus it sits in the noggin and then goes into the ether for and part of the reason I think when I see some of the major players that are even upstream from. Like a Morgan, that they’ve been like, look, we’re just going to be everywhere. And when some people don’t, the brand becomes ubiquitous. And we think a lot about our brand, some people remember it, and some people it’s sort of like in that ether that gets brought to the surface the moment they see it in a search. Yeah.
Angel Reyes 25:18
I mean, you know, one of the things we’re doing is some programmatic stuff. And really, what that is, that’s, it’s not really tippy top of the funnel, advertising funnel, but it’s, it’s sort of, it’s higher than we normally do. We really like to focus on what we call high intent. I mean, we would love, you know, our ads to only be seen by people that are seriously in the market, to hire an injury lawyer you know they had a crash yesterday or three days ago, or whatever, or their or their son or daughter or mother or father, whatever you know, has been in an unfortunate situation. We love high intent, right? But we also recognize that some of the programmatic stuff that we’re doing across some of it’s across social, and a lot of it’s across YouTube. I mean, we’re for now, a lot of money you’re getting, we are getting four or 5 million impressions, and so for us, you know, that is kind of how we want to percolate at that level. Because, man, Seth, I just don’t think people are watching broadcast TV. Man, I don’t know. I don’t know. I don’t remember the last time I did. And by the way, next year, the one thing that we all watch broadcast TV, well, we, we don’t all, but most of us, I suspect you Seth, watch a football or an NBA game or a World Series, right? Sports? Did you maybe already know that next year will be the first time you can watch any NFL game and you don’t have to use broadcast TV to find it and watch it? It’ll be the first year ever. And so what that tells me is that broadcast and cable are being totally disintermediated, right? People are going straight to the people that the media companies are going straight to folks who want to, want to see it. They’re streaming it to them. And I gotta tell you, if you’re under 40 and you still have cable, I’d be shocked. I’d be shocked. I mean, I just would be nobody, nobody. I know under 40 has it right? And so
Seth Price 27:20
My over-40 compromise is YouTube TV, which most people are not spending the 80 bucks on. They’re hodgepodging it with other apps, which you can do.
Angel Reyes 27:30
Yeah, you can be lazy.
Seth Price 27:33
But when you, when you look at it, you know, I’m looking at this stuff along those lines everybody in the media space, because all the broadcast players, local TV are trying to sell you in radio are trying to sell the whether it’s OTT or some sort of programmatic piece where they theoretically are getting big data to let you know when there’s that search intent. Yeah, and I’m just like, I’m cynical, but like it’s the only piece that’s sort of interesting at the same time, I just look like these are the same guys I don’t trust on anything else. I want to get your thoughts. Have you seen anybody who’s bringing that together and getting the intent in some sort of targeted fashion, as opposed to just
Angel Reyes 28:17
so you know, you can get pitched on Ott, by Prime, Amazon, by, you know, many, many, many, not just streaming app, but you know, they can also do their, their agencies, a little comprehensive, you know, streaming Ott, you know, program for you, right? We tried it a few years ago but weren’t successful.
Seth Price 28:41
I get that, but I’m going one step further. They’re trying to say, now it’s not just buying eyeballs but that was shocking. They’re allegedly now in the business of targeting people who’ve been injured at the same CPM as just buying general OTT. And I’m like, I would have to see the proof exactly. We’re heading in that direction, into the point where, like, as more and more Dad looks, we both know that if I search, my wife searches for something, I get the ads. Now, yeah, everything’s getting tied together.
Angel Reyes 29:20
Yeah. So let me ask you this, like, you know, our experience is that when somebody you know hits one of our paid ads or finds us, you know, and they call us, you know, we close those if we like. In this case, our close rates are like 85 or better. Man, right?
Seth Price 29:40
Normally, people exaggerate, you know, we’ve been, we’ve had days, we’re hitting low 90s, yeah, well, we’ve also had days, no no, no, no being. I’m just going to say it’s like, you’re being, you’re usually, every, always overestimates. I’m saying, like, I believe you,
Angel Reyes 29:53
yeah, so, so What the What that suggests to me, and I, you know, I’m open, I’m always all years about. These things. But what that suggests to me is that you know if, if somebody with high intent gets on a search and finds you and you talk to them, it’s unlikely that an ad or whatever is going to then later get them to call you back. You either close them on the first call or your shots like 20% after that. You
Seth Price 30:22
I think, I think that that’s to me a little usually, 85% of first-time callers close on the phone.
Angel Reyes 30:28
And so, how would it add
Seth Price 30:32
research? Some people argue that our, our, growth in the market is people who aren’t hiring a lawyer. They speak to somebody but don’t hire for whatever reason. We How could they possibly do that? Whereas, like, there are people that don’t offer from the insurance company, that’s one very large but statistically, it’s a huge bucket, right? It’s not like everybody hires a lawyer. We think a lot of ourselves, but the rest of the world doesn’t. I’m always amazed at how many people are. It’s a decision like, yeah. And look, you know, I’ll give you an example. This is not, you know, my mom, you know, you know, in New York, was at a museum, fell on a step very badly, and injured an arm, and there was, there was a hazard. And she was like, Yeah, I got, you know, my insurance is covering it. I’m good. So, like, no, again, that’s not she I don’t take it from a sample of one. But my point is, there, you know, there are the ones that are going to be instantaneous, so, right? And that’s where I’m cynical as to whether or not, if they’re pulling stuff out and you already got them, yeah, respect is going to happen. Are there people out there, just like you would see for like, immigration or family great example, those do family law, right? Somebody would wake up one day and say, I’m getting divorced today. I’m done, whereas they’ve thought about it for a year. They’ve had good days. They’re bad days. They may search experiment, so if you’re able to Part of the reason they don’t let us do a retargeted family. But the point is that if there is an inkling that somebody is in the market, that’s always a you know. So anyway, I’m very I’m fascinated. To me, the fundamentals are to search the multi offices. It’s the LSAS. It’s getting the reviews. It’s building up the organic domain authority. To me, built my firm. I wouldn’t have 50 lawyers, but for that, yeah. And so to me, everything else I can play with on top and I say play, it is play, metals locked in that’s what’s been what built me and our clients at BluShark is like, get the fundamentals right. Everything else will fall in place.
Angel Reyes 32:41
Everything else will fall well. We also feel the same way, you know, like, I try not to be too cynical, but, with Ott, we didn’t have a great experience. That was a few years ago. Maybe it’s gotten better, you know, I will be, I’ll be, you know, I’d be open to hearing about it again. But it’s
Seth Price 32:59
not like everything else, like if, for the last 10 years, how many people pitched you geofencing of the emergency room? You would invest in each of those people. Over 10 years, you’d have nothing to show for it. You’d have zero ROI, right? I know that there’s finally some possibility, yes, you could do some stuff. Maybe you know that people get some results. But for 10 years, I sort of feel like OTT similarly, that they’re figuring out what works and what doesn’t work, and that everybody who’s done OTT up to the present knows, and they’re trying to basically say, Hey, we’re getting better data. Will that work? So maybe I’ll be the guy who loses my money this time to tell you it’s not quite there yet, but I have no doubt they gotta figure it out, because you’re not in every eyeball and that’s where the attention is, it’s not like it’s nonconvertible. The question is, what’s the right price for it? Right? Right? You started out, when you started out, there were probably three, five networks you were dealing with. And so now, with streaming, it’s infinite, and the pricing has got to adjust accordingly, as well as the attention. You know, old school, we were sitting on a couch, and unless your father hit you to get up to go change the channel, it wouldn’t get changed like it is now. My kids can’t stand something for 10 seconds without a swipe. So
Angel Reyes 34:16
That’s exactly right. And so, you know, I don’t know. Look, OTT is attempting to, you know, get advertisers no different than, you know, the broadcast folks used to 2030, years ago. You know, they’re, they’re, they’re sort of selling proposition is, we’re going to, you know, our that’s where everyone’s going. So you better get there. I’m not sure. I don’t know. I’m not sure that’s really the strategy we’re going to take, but we definitely have to continue to do the same kind of digital strategies you’re doing. I mean, that’s what’s getting us here.
Seth Price 34:49
So as we, as we wrap up here, what excites you? What tips or tricks would you give to our audience? And what do you sort of like? What do you see next? Well.
Angel Reyes 34:59
Uh, next, a couple of things personally, give a tip. The tip. And, you know, I already told you a little bit about my story, the tip is, if you’re, I believe that you should find a niche and really focus and stick with it. Don’t get distracted. I personally am guilty. I got distracted three or four times over the last 30 years, and I don’t regret it, but I learned from it, and boy, since 2019 just focusing on auto and truck has made all the difference. So that’s one tip I would give to any lawyer out there that you know you can’t do everything, and if you are, you’re probably not doing all of it very well. So do something and do it well. That’d be my tip. I see, I see 20 more years of our practice auto and truck, and that’s more than most. And the reason I see that is it is, as with most things, let’s say self-driving cars. Let’s say, you know, Uber Lyft, and all of a sudden, you know flying, flying mini helicopters to get you places. Things happen, real, slow, slow, slow, slow, and then all at once, you’re like, Whoa, where’d this come from? I think that’s 20 years away. I mean, I think the cars on the road right now are going to stay on the road for 1020, or more years. I mean, you know, I just do, and so I’m not, I’m not afraid of the auto and truck world. And as far as, like, you know, new towards I’m going to keep focusing on my auto truck stuff. I don’t want to get distracted.
Seth Price 36:31
By having your run-in, right?
Angel Reyes 36:34
I’ve already done it. Younger partners that are rising up, you know, if they can figure it out that I’m all for it, you know, but until then, I think I’m just going to stay in my lane, and we’re going to continue to good work, and we’re going to maximize our client’s recoveries. And you know, that takes hard work, that takes filing a lawsuit most of the time in Texas.
Seth Price 36:54
Well, look, thank you so much for your time. I really appreciate it again.
Angel Reyes 37:00
We’re gonna, we’re gonna, I’m gonna see you soon. I know it. I love it, probably early summer. Maybe
Seth Price 37:05
That sounds great. Thank you so much for your time. Take care, man. See you. Bye for now.
Outro 37:11
Thank you for tuning in to the SEO insider with Seth’s price. Be sure to check back next week for fresh insights into building your brand’s online presence. Episodes are available to stream directly on BluShark Digital’s website.
